I know Rob, Nico, and I are, and I'm hoping there will be at least a few more of you who join us on this as well...

When I was at the lake on Monday, I had asked a few questions about the possible draining and such. The lake workers told me they were not allowed to comment, but instead, they gave me a contact number for a Mr. Charles Hardy. (510-287-0141 in case you want to speak with him directly). I called and taked to him for about 30 minutes yesterday. Very nice guy, who did not try to rush me off the phone.

In a nutshell, Mr. Hardy told me that there was going to be an initial meeting at Olinda School (somewhere near Kennedy Park, at the base of San Pablo Dam Res.) on Nov. the 17th (Weds), at 7PM, to discuss the future of the lake. He said that they were looking for people of all different interests to discuss there ideas and opinions. I know I sure have a few of my own ! (and talking about them has never been a problem for me :-) He said there would be people there from EBMD (who of course care about water sales), people respresenting the Ca DFG, and hopefully, a number of very interested, and informed fishermen.

Mr. Hardy also said that by being at this preliminary meeting, you would be able to have your name added to a list, so that you would then be kept informed about future meetings, and any progress on the dam rebuilding project.

This is pretty much all I know right now. So if you have any more questions, again Mr. Hardy's # is: 510-287-0141

Thanks for your attention to this matter,
Fish Chris

PS, Just remember..... If you don't go, and if the whole thing ends up going to crap, with Pablo never being opened for fishing again (a distinct possibility) you won't be able to say very much......

I hope to see a good showing of bass guys at this important meeting.

Like Chris said, if you don't go to the meeting, don't complain later if things don't go the way you were hoping!

Can someone post directions or atleast an address and maybe a reminder the Monday prior? It may be hard for me coming from Hollister at 4:30, but I'll try.
Tight lines,
Wade

Here's the address

4350 Valley View Rd.
El Sobrante, CA 94803-1452

and a map

http://www.calfishing.com/dc/user_files/2950.gif

Attachment #1, (.gif file)

Would it be better to go up I-880 (101.8 Miles) or I-680 thru Concord and come over on 4 (112.2 Miles) during the commute hours? Does anyone want to share the ride & say 25% of the costs from anywhere along the way?
Tight lines,
Wade

were are you leaving from?
Catch Alot,Photograph a few,Release them all...

Hollister after work at 4:30, 25N to 101N to either 680N or 880N. Where are you located? I know Rob lives in Fremont and was wondering if he might care to carpool? I don't care if we take my car or someone elses, just so more people are there to get the fishing voice heard.
Tight lines,
Wade

I'm in santa barbara area,a little far but i do care about our lakes even if its one i've never fished.with our water or lack there of problem you'd think they would find a better solution than draining it all the way.

to be quite honest with you, San Pablo Dam Res. has developed so many problems, a couple of which can only be solved by draining the lake completely (Spotted Bass and Carp) that I would be crushed to hear that they were going to fix the dam "without" draining it all the way.......
But maybe we will know more after the meeting.

Peace,
Fish

I got an email yesterday from norcalfishing.com. I had asked them for any and all info regarding the lake. All they said to me was that they expect to be open for the next two years at least.

That would also kind of suck. This would most likely just mean 2 more years added to the already long time required to turn the lake into an awesome fishery once again.

But also, I think one should consider that most places of employment would not want there employees to believe that they were going to shut down shop very soon, "unless they were 100% sure" that was the case..... as they would start losing there crew immediatly, and might find those shoes difficult to fill, with negative prospects for future job security...... Or, I could be completely wrong. Just a thought.

Peace,
Fish

I actually fished San Pablo quite a bit several years ago, but have recently turned my interests to the ocean.

My question is this. Even if we rid the lake of Carp and Spotted Bass, is it a permanent solution? If they were able to appear once, why couldn't they appear again? All it takes is a few carp eggs stuck to a goose's foot to re-introduce carp, or maybe a jackass throwing some carp and/or smallmouth bass into the lake. The reason I ask, is because the short-term solution of killing off all unwanted species in a lake never seems to work. Just look at the pike problem in Lake Davis or the Lake Trout problem in yellowstone lake.

The difference between this and other failed fish removal projects like Davis lake is that they will be draining the lake down to basically nothing. When the lake is down to it's lowest point, it really will be possible to poison it and remove everything. Depending how low it goes, there could be a 'natural' fish kill anyway due to lack of oxygen. The carp would probably survive that but the spots might not. Even if carp and goldfish are illegally transplanted back into the lake, at least you'd start out with a level playing field by killing everything. If they drain it down and let the carp live, and let the spots live, it's pointless... The lake will never be great again for trophy bass.

If Florida strain bass were introduced >on purpose< while the Carp had to sneak there way back in, it would give the bass a big head start, allowing them a strong foothold.

As far as Spotted bass re-appearing..... hmmm. Maybe. But then maybe not. Understand that it took 15 years for Spots to make there way into Pablo, and many (most) Bay Area trout ponds still do not have Spots.

Finally, any time a lake is completely drained for a period of time, it allows a layer of new growth, which binds most of the old bottom sediment (does wonders for water quality), and adds tons of the >proper< nutrients (not golf course fertilizer runoff) to kick the new lake (after it is refilled) into overdrive ! Typically, no lake is better for numbers than a 3 to 5 year old one, and no lake is better for trophy bass, than a 10 to 13 year old one.... then, they usually start to drop off. That is the normal cycle. Pablo did go through this same cycle. The only amazing thing was, it came back with even more, and slightly larger giants, on its second peak, aproximately 20 years after being drained and refilled. In any case, I am thouroughly convinced that Pablo would not ever come back that way again, with an overpopulation of Spotted Bass, and poor water quality.

Starting to ramble now...
Fish

I have a question about the fishing suddenly dropping off at Pablo. How could this happen so fast, when it seemed like it was kicking out hawgs on a regular basis just a short while ago? There's no doubt that the monsters still lurk in that lake, but why has it become so hard to catch them? I think it was 2001? when fish chris had a phenomenal late summer and fall at Pablo. Seemed like you stuck a 10+ on every trip out there. Could that have been that those fish were uneducated at the time to the trout baits, or do lakes have certain years when the fishing is just off the hook?

Well here's my take on Pablo for the last 5 years or so...

People have been catching big bass at Pablo for years, however after the 2 stroke ban on the lake bass fisherman stayed away because most bass boats dont have 4 strokes. People during this time were catching big bass but being quiet about it. Then Rob and Fish Chris among others, including me, starting posting their reports about catching and seeing these big bass, which caused others to join in the hunt. So with increased pressure these fish were being caught and released more than once and could have become educated to lures.

Add to the fact that fertilizer is being used upstream on the golf course, and is getting washed into the lake causing water quality problems. There is also the problem with a large amount of carp that are prevalent in the lake. Some people believe they may eat bass eggs, but we know that during spring they roam the shallows kicking up silk and helping mess up the water quality. Last but not least is the fact over the last few years spotted bass in one way or another have populated the lake in a big way which just adds to the competition that the double digits have to deal with.

As an afterthought, San Pablo has very limited shore cover, something more fisherman key on, and the increased pressure could have moved fish off of these more recognizable spots and to places that most bass fisherman do not normally fish..

This is just my opinion... any others??
Erik P.

I definitely think the bass got smarter. No question there. I caught a couple real nice ones in 2003 on some pretty weird areas, areas where I think the fish just moved to to avoid pressure. This year though, it's indescribeable how much it seems like the big bass have just disappeared completely. I never saw a fish over 3lbs on a bed this year or even near a bed. I've seen maybe 4 or 5 fish over 10 period all year. I fished the lake for 10 full day trips and caught one 10lber. I probably would have gone more but just got discouraged really. Fish Chris fished it the same or more than I did and caught one 11lber. BobH can chime in if he wants on how many he got since I have a feeling he fished it more than me or Chris, but basically the fishing just sucked all year in all conditions. Maybe some guys got them this year and they're fishing weekdays and not saying a word. But it would suprise me.

Another thing to consider, in the years from 2000-2003 I think I caught something like 2 spotted bass. This year I caught at least 15. They're everywhere. It just sucks. This year I also saw the most unreal numbers of carp and goldfish I've ever seen. They were so thick in one spot last month I was hitting them with my bait and you could feel the twang on your line as you reeled through shallow water knocking the carp this way and that. That many carp just can't be a good thing. And I doubt the goldfish are helping either. I saw people hauling in goldfish left and right all summer this year fishing from the shore. There must be a goldfish every 10 feet for how many people were catching.

I guess my attitude is just like you know what, the lake is going downhill, everything seems jacked up, now they're going to drain it anyway so let's just say screw it - kill it off and start fresh. Believe me, if they had announced this 2 or 3 years ago, I would have been devastated!

As an aside, I worked with Western Outdoor News last week to get a piece in about San Pablo for this weeks edition. The Northern Edition editor was very helpful and he put the article on the top of the first page. Hopefully this can get some more people to the meeting.

I can't talk about how many I landed over ten this year as it was basically none. Hooked three over ten including one for sure 15 but they all came unbuttoned. Suckola! I heard of a 16 caught by a trout fisher in May.
As for what's going on with the bass I have a pet theory but it's just a theory. First of all I don't think the total number has gone down that much. I base this on the fact that all the bass I have caught and seen caught this year look as enormously fat and healthy as SP bass always did. So if their size distribution curve was screwed up you would expect to see some malnutrition or other physical evidence. Also at over 800 acres SP has a lot of carrying capacity for its bass population. Some bass have "gone up the bank" so there is some reduction, but not that much on a percentile basis.
Second, I still chart huge balls of bait everywhere just like always so that coupled with trout plants mean plenty of food. Third, while the Spots will probably compete with juvenile bass they have no impact on the big girls short term. Long term they may destroy the fishery, but short term they just don't compete with the trophy fish. Fourth, I know another guy who fishes there regularly for the non-trophy bass and his catch ratio is way down too. All the bass wouldn't disappear simultaneously. People just don't kill that many bass out of SP. Fifth, for swimbaits you need enough visibility for the bass to see the bait from any distance and SP has been a mudhole so reduced swimbait catches are probably a function of water clarity.
I tend to fish the cover myself and they just really haven't been on it thick as in years past. So where are they? Here's my theory - Bass love cover. I have seen a study where a dozen bass were put in a large circular tank. They distributed evenly all over the tank. Then they put a plank hanging over the edge and ALL the bass got under it. Then they painted a vertical stripe on the side and all the bass went over and hovered around it. Keep in mind that this was gin clear water. Now imagine what happens when the water is totally murky. It changes the visual parameters entirely. I think in really murky water bass just don't have the same need for cover whether for security, ambush or just plain instinct. I grew up fishing mudholes in the south and I know bass thrive in the mud. So where are they? All over the lake (in open water probably following the bait and/or trout) and not concentrated where we can fish them with any regularity. As any one knows who fishes SP much you probably have to put your bait in front of twenty bass to get one to bite so when they're not concentrated in spots it just gets majorly tough.
The other intangible thing is that SP was tough enough as it was, having to fish hard all day for several bites, but when it gets this tough it's just about impossible to stay focussed for a whole day. Whether this theory is right or not SP is still in deep trouble as all the things going on (carp, spots, fertilizer) will wreck it long term. Bob

One thing that I could never really figure out about San Pablo was this. It seems that the bass are very difficult to catch because there is so much bait in the water, plus the trout that they stock weekly. But, each year without fail, there are many bass taken by power bait. Power bait! Why are the bass eating power bait, when there is so much bait in the lake to eat??

I really believe that bass do just eat power bait straight up because of the scent. I mean why would trout eat it like it's the best thing ever and bass not eat it at all? They're both predators at some level. It makes total sense to me that a bass would eat powerbait because Berkeley has something in powerbait that gives off a very fish attracting smell. Sometimes it might be a case of a trout eating the powerbait and then a bass eating that trout, but I think the odds of people landing those fish is actually pretty small. Powerbait hooks are typically size #12 or #14 trebles.

I think the reason you see so much of it at Pablo is because it's murky and the bass don't get a good look at it, and more importantly, San Pablo has more trout fisherman than just about anywhere I've ever seen. I mean anyone who has fished there in the spring knows that there will be 300+ people fishing for trout on many weekends. It's just an odds game at that point since inevitably many bass will swim in front of gobs of powerbait. A lot of bass get caught on nightcrawlers and dough balls there for the same reason.

It's a shame, but a whole lot of those fish wind up getting killed because people are fishing for food or just don't know or care about bass. The lake record and the other 18.0lb fish caught out of there were both caught by trout fisherman and killed. I think both were on nightcrawler/powerbait combos.

Things like this are why I wrote the DFG Commission months ago to propose that no bass over 22" be allowed to be kept. What I've heard since is that the Commission is very reluctant to use slot limits or maximum size limits on bass becuase they think it's too confusing, but at least I'm trying. I'll be bringing this up again during the discussions about draining the dam to try to again highlight the issue.

So far all I hear is no you won't get anywhere, and no the DFG, the Commission, and the EBMUD will do nothing. But I'm still going to try, and I ask for everyone's support in whatever way they can. We can throw up our hands and give up or we can try to do something. We can look at lousy situations and complain or we can try to do something. I'll feel a lot better in the end for having tried, irregardless of the outcome.

Bob

Well I would have felt like quite a dolt if you had stuck a bunch of huge ones, but it sounds like your experiencing the same type of fishing as I have... That is encouraging that you hooked one really big one. Sorry to hear it got away :( Nico and I actually found that numbers fishing was great this year for some reason. A mix of spots and small largemouth mostly. I had couple trips where we caught like 7 or 8 keeper sized bass and one trip where we caught I think 14. It may have had something to do with us getting more desperate and trying more new techniques and small fish techniques hoping to luck into a bigger bite along the way. It's just not the same lake though.

The Fisheries and Wildlife director for the lake implied to me that low water has changed the fishing locations and that I needed to try lures that look like trout... Basically saying that I might just not know what I'm doing out there. Sorry but... I am not the kind of fisherman who just sticks with one thing or fishes historically good spots. I pulled out all the stops this summer trying new water, new baits and of course plenty of trout baits, and those fish just either aren't there or aren't biting. The problem with trying to prove my point is that neither me nor him has the data to make any conclusions. EBMUD does an annual electrofishing survey in the fall, but they skipped it in 2003, and I don't think it's been done yet in 2004. Any data I collect is skewed because I don't have enough data for one, and I'm only targeting big fish for two. The real answer will only come if they do a thorough electrofishing survey this year. Then we'll see what's really in there ... unless they are all offshore chasing those bait balls, which you are right - they could be out there.

So does anyone want to carpool with me? Otherwise, I might be a little strapped to justify 200+ miles round trip by myself. Would anyone rather have me meet them somewhere and take their car, and I'll pay for 1/2 the gas from there.
Tight lines,
Wade

Hey Guys, I live in Castro Valley if someone out there wants to hook up and carpool to the meeting. Please let me know by e-mail at basshunter4u@aol.com We need to all go to this meeting for support of our lakes

Don Osborne

mrcastaic